According to John’s vision (Revelation 7:9), heaven will be filled with people who are still recognized by their ethnicity (every nation, tribe, people, and language). So, if we want the church here and now to reflect that, Sunday mornings must stop being the most segregated time of the week.
That’s the premise of my conversation with Jamaal Williams and Timothy Paul Jones, the co-authors of In Church as It Is in Heaven: Cultivating a Multiethnic Kingdom Culture, which I named as one of my best nonfiction books of the year for 2024.
Jamaal and Timothy focus on what we can do to create a more kingdom-minded approach to ethnic diversity, while acknowledging that ethnic diversity is not the point of the church, but a byproduct of the gospel message.
Links from this Episode
Bonus Content
3 Steps to Move Your Church Toward Multiethnic Generosity, with Jamaal Williams and Timothy Paul Jones
One of the habits (liturgies) that Jamaal Williams and Timothy Paul Jones suggest in their book, In Church as It Is in Heaven: Cultivating a Multiethnic Kingdom Culture, is to help your church move toward multiethnic generosity.
I talked with them as they suggest a simple plan to visit a faithful, gospel-driven church outside your own ethnicity or culture once every three months. Embrace this habit as an opportunity to learn from sisters and brothers in other cultures. And when you do, walk through these three steps:
- Consider your own preferences
- Visit the other church
- Be grateful for your preferences—and be willing to lay them down
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Credits
Producer: Veronica Beaver
Editor: Phil Vaters
Music: Composed and performed by Jack Wilkins
Logo: by Solomon Joy
Correspondence
Author
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Karl Vaters produces resources for Helping Small Churches Thrive at KarlVaters.com.
He's the author of five books on church leadership, including his newest, De-Sizing the Church: How Church Growth Became a Science, Then an Obsession, and What's Next. His other books include The Grasshopper Myth and Small Church Essentials.
Karl also hosts a bi-weekly podcast, The Church Lobby: Conversations on Faith & Ministry, featuring in-depth interviews about topics that concern pastors, especially those who minister in a small church context. He has served in small-church ministry for over 40 years, so he speaks and writes from decades of hands-on pastoral experience.
You can follow Karl on Facebook, Instagram, X, YouTube, and LinkedIn, or Contact Karl to inquire about speaking, writing, and consultation.
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